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7,906 Views 12 Replies Last post: Nov 3, 2009 3:35 PM by BelindaD RSS
Level 0 4 posts since
Nov 2, 2009
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Nov 3, 2009 6:04 AM

Createspace as temporary publisher

Here's what I want to do:

 

1. Use createspace as a publisher for the book, and have them assign me an ISBN.

 

2. Be able to work with a big publisher once things take off in the future

 

I understand that the ISBN might mean that createspace own the rights to my book. I don't want to mess around with getting an ISBN, but then this makes createspace the publisher.

 

So long as I am free to work with a big publisher in the future should one show interest, I will use createspace.

Level 3 499 posts since
Jan 8, 2009
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1. Nov 3, 2009 6:15 AM in response to: yoyo778
Re: Createspace as temporary publisher
Createspace will not own the rights to your book. They will however own the rights to that ISBN. You could at any time switch to a big publisher, sell them the publishing rights, and the publishing company could then assign their own ISBN.
Level 4 1,384 posts since
Feb 25, 2009
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2. Nov 3, 2009 8:34 AM in response to: yoyo778
Re: Createspace as temporary publisher

Karla's correct. Createspace will never own the rights to your book. You maintain all those rights and can take your book to other publishers to see about getting published while using CS, though of course you will have to tell them it is self published under Createspace. That is a non-exclusive thing so you can pull the book at any time from them and they will stop selling it (however, the listing will remain on Amazon as out of print when or if ever do that).

The only thing CS holds the rights to is their assigned ISBN that will list them as publisher. That they own, your book...that's yours.

Level 1 161 posts since
Jan 17, 2009
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4. Nov 3, 2009 10:04 AM in response to: yoyo778
Re: Createspace as temporary publisher
What  I like about CS is that you can edit your book at any given moment. Not so with Lulu, It was hard to get their attention so I could edit my book. My book was jacked up and they put it on their website  for sale immediately. They tool forever to respond to my request so I could change my book cover. By the time they replied I had cancelled my account. CS and Lulu are print on demand books, Lulu is too expensive, so I am thrilled to have a great quality but inexpensive book published through CS, Createspace. I believe you pay lesser on createspace and get paid more than on Lulu.  But I could be wrong on the latter.
Level 4 1,384 posts since
Feb 25, 2009
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5. Nov 3, 2009 12:49 PM in response to: yoyo778
Re: Createspace as temporary publisher
Getting Lulu's free ISBN is the same as having one assigned from Createspace. Lulu's ISBN will list them as your publisher, you cannot take the ISBN anywhere else, etc. To be perfectly honest, while I'm a member of Lulu and just use them to sell on their marketplace, I much prefer CS as it's easier to make revisions, you do earn more here (especially if you use Createspace's Pro Plan) and customer support isn't quite as tricky here as over there.
Level 4 1,384 posts since
Feb 25, 2009
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7. Nov 3, 2009 1:35 PM in response to: yoyo778
Re: Createspace as temporary publisher
Lulu is also non-exclusive. They do not own the rights to your book anymore than CS would. You can take your book off Lulu at any time, I believe Belinda told you the same thing on Lulu's forum. With Lulu, it does take 6-8 weeks or longer to remove a book from active distribution. Again, it will list as out of print on Amazon once you remove it from Lulu distro.
Level 4 1,384 posts since
Feb 25, 2009
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8. Nov 3, 2009 2:11 PM in response to: yoyo778
Re: Createspace as temporary publisher

Since you're asking the same questions on both this and Lulu's forums and you'll get basically the same answers on both. Being non-exclusive just means that CS isn't locking you into a long term contract. You can take your title and leave either place at any time. Neither place owns the rights to your book. They do own their ISBNs so if you make a book on either Lulu or CS and then choose to remove the title from sale you would have to retire the edition.

 

You can call CS support and ask them your questions, they may or may not give you a straight answer or they may say to read the member agreement which you could have a lawyer do. The issue you may have is some traditional publishers may not touch you if you've self-published, so that's something you will have to look into with the big publishers you may be considering.

 

Very few forum members are going to have the TOS memorzied so they can copy/paste one particular section, I'm afraid.

Level 5 15,188 posts since
May 4, 2008
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10. Nov 3, 2009 2:42 PM in response to: yoyo778
Re: Createspace as temporary publisher

You would be surprised how many people enter into contracts/agreements without reading the fine print.

 

(Probably the same number of people who start formatting their book files without first reading the submission guidelines - in not so fine print!)

Level 4 1,073 posts since
Sep 4, 2008
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11. Nov 3, 2009 3:17 PM in response to: yoyo778
Re: Createspace as temporary publisher

Hi Yoyo.

Those are the parts of the CS member agreement you might look for:

 

6. Licenses; Ownership; Feedback

6.1 Content

Subject to the following paragraph, you grant to us a nonexclusive license, during the term of this Agreement, to (a) create digital versions of Content you provide in nondigital format; (b) create a digitized version of the Content that we will use to create a Unit (each, a "Source File") and, if applicable (for music and video only), a nearly lossless digital file (a "Future-Proof Archive File") using your Content; (c) with respect to Books, print, publish, distribute and sell you Book through the CreateSpace E-stores, the Amazon Properties and other sales channels, (d) reformat, reproduce, and distribute your Content through the CreateSpace E-Stores, the Amazon Properties, and other sales channels in digital form on physical media, (e) reformat for online delivery, reproduce and distribute your Content through the Amazon Properties in digital form via Amazon Video On Demand or Amazon MP3, as applicable, subject to content usage rules that are in accordance with Section 6.2 below; (f) create Promotional Clips from your video and audio Content, provided that we will only create Promotional Clips upon your request for Titles not distributed through Amazon Video On Demand or Amazon MP3; (g) distribute, display, transmit, perform and use the Promotional Clips (if any) and the Descriptive Materials for promotional purposes; and (h) create Packaging Materials from the Descriptive Materials.

 

6.4 Ownership

Subject to the licenses set forth in this Section 6 and the following sentence, and as between the parties, you own all right, title and interest in and to the Content, including all patent, copyright, trademark, service mark, mask work, moral right, trade secret or other intellectual property or proprietary right (collectively, "Intellectual Property Rights") therein. Subject to your underlying rights in the Content, as between the parties, we will own all right, title and interest in and to the templates and other materials created, provided or used by us in our performance under this Agreement (including Source Files, Future-Proof Archive Files and Packaging Materials, including all Intellectual Property Rights therein.

 

10. Term; Termination

This Agreement will remain in effect until terminated in accordance with this Section. You may terminate this Agreement at any time by giving noticeto us, and we may terminate this Agreement at any time by sending you an e-mail notice at the e-mail address associated with your account. Our notice of such termination will be effective at the time we send you the notice. Upon termination, you will pay us whatever fees were incurred prior to the date of the termination. Also upon termination: (a) we may fulfill any Customer orders pending as of the date of termination; and (b) we may continue to maintain digital copies of your Content in order to provide "refresh" copies or otherwise support customers who have purchased or rented a Title via Amazon Video On Demand prior to termination. Upon termination, we may set off against any payments to be made to you, an amount determined by us to be adequate to cover any disputes, chargebacks and refunds from your account for a prospective three-month period. At the end of such three-month period following termination, we will refund any amount not used to offset chargebacks and refunds to you, or seek reimbursement from you via any of the means authorized in Section 5.1 above for any additional amount required to offset chargebacks and refunds, as applicable.

 

Message was edited by: TheDesignHouse

Level 3 658 posts since
Jul 14, 2008
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12. Nov 3, 2009 3:35 PM in response to: yoyo778
Re: Createspace as temporary publisher

yoyo778 wrote:

 

Where in lulu's member agreement does it specify that you can take the book to a big publisher if you want to? You say it's the same policy as createspace, so I just need to know where. I have different projects some of which are more createspace suitable and some would be better with lulu, providing it is non-exclusive and I can work with a big publisher on the same book. I just need to know where in lulu's agreement it says that.I doubt lulu would get away with keeping the rights to a work anyway, that would be a MAJOR flaw and authors would hate it. But still, it must be made clear either way.

It's sections 10 and 11 of Lulu's member agreement that relate to non-exclusivity. I've also replied in your thread at Lulu, with the link to the Lulu Help page with further details of (and restrictions relating to) on ISBNs.

 

Neither CreateSpace nor Lulu retain any rights to your work. Nor do they keep any rights to the work itself, but only the right to control the ISBNs issued to them by the ISBN Agency (as they are required to do by the rules of having ISBNs issued to them).

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